'Kiefer'?

[GoldenArrow]

Have we (you) discussed his stuff on here yet?

Seems interesting, here's all I've seen of his stuff:

http://articles.elitefts.com/articles/nutrition/logic-does-not-apply-iii-a-calorie-is-a-calorie/

[JonnyJames]

Is all that not already quite well known? I remember reading a user comment on an article on T-Nation many years ago to the tune of 'When I cut I drop my calories a little and increase my protein intake a lot.'

[Dave284]

He seems to get good results and be popular with the EliteFTS guys who use him.

[GoldenArrow]

'When I cut I drop my calories'
....would do for a witty quote.

It's the manipulation of hormones to make carbs be used more/less effectively that seems to be the thing he is conquering. Although it may just be the insulin shots...

[JonnyJames]

Dammit I wish people would stop providing me with signature-worthy material! Or perhaps I should just wish to be less malleable.

[GoldenArrow]

I'm researching his site. He seems like my/our kind of guy (see the crossfit article on the other thread)

[ATZ]

Alan,

what are your thoughts on John Kiefer's ideas of carb backloading? Basically that you should eat all of your carbs PWO and thereafter and should stick to working out later in the evening due to your insulin resistance being better.

any thoughts on this?

Response:

I think it's comedic.

[LWStrong]

I agree with Alan.

His second name is Aragon and surely I do not need a better reason than that.

[GoldenArrow]

Well that reply is well referenced...

[ATZ]

Well that reply is well referenced...

Well it's because the whole nutrient timing thing has been done to death, the benefit of backloading is gonna be marginal at best verses having your carbs distrubuted evenly throughout the day.

[GoldenArrow]

I'm not saying I'm for or against his approach, but things I do like about him are:

- EVERYTHING is referenced....to the point of being ridiculous, but he's not just making stuff up
- There is some science there. I'm not a scientist so I can't tell you if his understanding of glut-4 is correct or if having the carbs earlier or later would make a difference, but again it seems to be correct science and is referenced so at least some other scientist has come to the same conclusion. Compared with 'this is how cavemen used to eat', it makes a lot more sense.
- He has testimonials from some big names in the powerlifting world, they wouldn't do something that was going to impact their strength AND
- He has testimonials from bbers who were of a competitive standard before starting working with him, so presumably have tried all the 'usual' approaches and also would drop him pretty fast if they weren't seeing better results than before.

The perhaps naive conclusion is that if you wanted to have big muscles, be strong and be lean, you'd follow his approach. Of course, it does seem rather hard to pin down what that actually is if you wanted to follow his carb back-loading rather than carb nite...

[ATZ]

I'm not saying I'm for or against his approach, but things I do like about him are:

- EVERYTHING is referenced....to the point of being ridiculous, but he's not just making stuff up
- There is some science there. I'm not a scientist so I can't tell you if his understanding of glut-4 is correct or if having the carbs earlier or later would make a difference, but again it seems to be correct science and is referenced so at least some other scientist has come to the same conclusion. Compared with 'this is how cavemen used to eat', it makes a lot more sense.
- He has testimonials from some big names in the powerlifting world, they wouldn't do something that was going to impact their strength AND
- He has testimonials from bbers who were of a competitive standard before starting working with him, so presumably have tried all the 'usual' approaches and also would drop him pretty fast if they weren't seeing better results than before.

The perhaps naive conclusion is that if you wanted to have big muscles, be strong and be lean, you'd follow his approach. Of course, it does seem rather hard to pin down what that actually is if you wanted to follow his carb back-loading rather than carb nite...


If you like referenced claims, look up Alan Aragon or Lyle Mcdonald's stuff. Pretty much any nutritional or supplement claim can be checked for validity via these two, and you'll get an unbiased scientific answer to it. Aragon even publishes a monthly research review, so his views on certain topics change as newer research comes to light. Hence my quote above. Isolated references can be very misleading, you need to see what the picture of the whole research paints.

I'm not saying carb backloading is complete bunk, it will have a marginal benefit over a traditional meal pattern, but it's key use would likely be the mediation of Leptin during periods of dieting. Keifer certainly isn't the first to coin this concept, check Mcdonald's Ultimate Diet 2.0, and more recently Berkhan's "Leangains" It forms the basis of these sort of diets, and results speak for themselves.

As for testimonials, they mean jack to me. I'd prefer to see if his idea's actually stand up to scientific scruitiny and his peers. Anyone can pay someone to say their approach is the best, it's pretty common for authours to e-fellate each other in a massive game of circle jerk so the reader thinks that's the number one appraoch. Efs are notorious for this.