View Full Version : Safe form and technique for the back squat
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 08:51
This post shall explain, as simply as possible, safe form and technique for the back squat.
The back squat as defined: Standard Olympic Bar accross traps or lower, squat down vertically to safe depth then stand upright - repeat.
This post will concentrate on safe technique for the back squat alone, no comment shall be made on squat variation.
The purpose of this post is to detail the safest way to effectively squat, not the most impressive way.
Firstly squat in a proper power rack or squat rack. Avoid machines (smith etc) and avoid squatting outside the safe confines of a rack.
Place the bar on the power rack stops slightly lower than your shoulders, too high and it will be hard to return, too low and you will waste energy.
Approach the bar and get under it by bending the knees not the back.
Position yourself under the bar so that it rests centrally, equal amounts on either side, anywhere lower than cervical vertebrae 7, this is the lump that is most prominent in the back of your neck when you lean your head forward.
The lower you hold the bar the more stable it is, yet you will be limited on the position depending upon you pec and delt flexibility.
Try to avoid padding the bar as this will make it less stable. Your traps will grow to pad this area and after some weeks of squatting you will not feel it. Try squeezing the shoulder blades together to increase the muscle density at the resting site of the bar. Once you have built some decent mass you should find a nice groove for the bar accross the rear delts.
Grip the bar solidly with a shoulder width grip, do not just rest your hands on it. Try to pull the bar apart, much as is advised for the bench press, this will increase strength irradiation.
Lift the bar from the stops by straightening the legs.
Step back as little as possible.
The taller you are the wider you will need to space your feet and flare your toes. Learn your foot spacing and toe flare with an empty bar so that you naturally assume this stance when squatting properly.
Squat between your thighs not onto them, this will help ensure a flat back, Bear this fact in mind when choosing spacing and flare.
Lower yourself to a point 2 inches above the point at which your back rounds. Ideally you will squat to the bottom, at first you may well not be flexible enough for this, get someone to watch you squat with an empty bar and let you know where your back begins to round. As your tendons stretch with time and patience you will squat lower and lower. Maintain a flat back all the way down.
Pause at the bottom if you wish, this is optional.
Push through the HEELS ON FLAT FEET. All the weight should be felt through the heels not the toes. When you reach the top either repeat or return the bar to the stops.
If you feel the need to raise your heels when squatting then you need to stretch your achilles tendons over the period of months, this is the only safe way. Until then squat as shallowly as is safe.
Words of caution!
Do not raise the heels.
Avoid squatting to an object unless very advanced and controlled, this can compress the spine.
Keep a flat back - a flat back actually means preserving the natural curve of the back, your spine is straight inside. Do not let it round.
Ensure your knees are not forward of your toes.
Squat in solid shoes, not trainers, especially not those with air soles.
AL
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 09:42
Whats your thoughs on squatting bare footed?
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 09:58
Some, like McRobert say it is a bad thing. Bad for your arches.
Others however swear by it, they say "Sh1t my feet hurt!"
I am not sure that there is a definative good or bad on this one. Anyone else?
AL
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 10:01
See the thing is i have been squatting bare foot since july and find my stability is better, general trainers are not so good imo as they are not specific, If you want foot wear you need either oly lifting shoes or those chuck is it? The power lifters rave about depending on your style
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 10:06
Yes those Converse Chuck Taylors are great to squat and lift all sorts in, i have them and can vouch for them.
Even better however are the Addidas Pretero Lifting boots, i got mine from Pullum, they are excellent.
AL
i use a pair of flatish soled reebok trainers... is this ok?
i tried barefoot aswell but found these to be better for me
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 10:14
yes those are the ones i was thinking of, not a bad price at £50 either i thought they cost more like £80
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 10:15
i use a pair of flatish soled reebok trainers... is this ok?
i tried barefoot aswell but found these to be better for meI used to use adidas sambas when i trained in a gym
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 10:32
i use a pair of flatish soled reebok trainers... is this ok?
i tried barefoot aswell but found these to be better for me
Is the sole relatively firm, you want as little give as possible. Are they thicker at the heel than the toe?
AL
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 10:35
yes those are the ones i was thinking of, not a bad price at £50 either i thought they cost more like £80
They are great, they are about as heavy as air! Also they get you really near the floor, the soles are very thin, great to lift in and supportive too, worth the money imo.
AL
yep the sole is pretty solid
veeery slightly thicker at the heel but not much!
i dont have anything better at the moment, figured they would do until i bought some decent boots?
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 10:40
Those Adidas are very tepting, i think i know what i want for xmas now :D
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 10:40
They don't sound too bad
AL
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 10:41
Those Adidas are very tepting, i think i know what i want for xmas now :D
Do it!
AL
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 10:43
Ok will do!
where can i get those adidas boots from, ive got some spare money and thinking about getting a pair
GoldenArrow
31-10-2004, 11:29
http://www.sports-shoes.net/
I'm sure they're wrestling boots though...
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 11:54
http://www.sports-shoes.net/
I'm sure they're wrestling boots though...
http://www.sports-shoes.net/product.asp?sectionid=318&productid=484&catalogue=9 seems your right but odly the weight lifting shoes seem to have bigger heals than the front of the sole?
also only £35 + £5 delivery so thats a bit cheaper too! :035: <buff>
I think (not sure thought) that Knighty once told me that a fair share of the problems he's been having recently are down to lifting barefooted, so you might want to ask him about it.
I honestly wouldn't worry about a pair of squat shoes. Chuck Taylors do a lot of people fine and they're a lot cheaper.
Alex - You say you shouldn't raise your heels during the squat. Can you clarify why? Oly lifters do it (oly shoes have a raised heel especially for this purpose) and they suffer from far fewer injuries than p'lifters and strongmen, so I'm wondering why you're advising against it.
GoldenArrow
31-10-2004, 13:00
Well I've lifted in wrestling boots for a while, as close as you're going to get to barefoot while still having some grip!
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 13:24
Mrs Dogg has ok'd the wrestling boots ;)
The taller you are the wider you will need to space your feet and flare your toes.
I am 6ft tall, although not very tall I dont need to flare my toes at all, I have them pointing straight forward. If you need to point them out then flexibility maybe an issue.
think im probs gonna get them boots, cant wait now :D
Squatting barefooted screwed my knee up!I now have orthotics to go in my trainers because of problems with arches in my feet. I have got a pair of army boots that I will get some orthotics for and these will be more squatting shoes for the future
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 16:16
where can i get those adidas boots from, ive got some spare money and thinking about getting a pair
I got mine from pullum sports
AL
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 16:18
http://www.sports-shoes.net/
I'm sure they're wrestling boots though...
Perhaps but they work perfectly for lifting boots.
AL
GoldenArrow
31-10-2004, 16:24
Yup. I chose them over trainers (had them due to, er, being a wrestler) due to the increased stability. I'm sure the link is cheaper than Pullum on the plus side!
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 16:34
I think (not sure thought) that Knighty once told me that a fair share of the problems he's been having recently are down to lifting barefooted, so you might want to ask him about it.
I honestly wouldn't worry about a pair of squat shoes. Chuck Taylors do a lot of people fine and they're a lot cheaper.
Alex - You say you shouldn't raise your heels during the squat. Can you clarify why? Oly lifters do it (oly shoes have a raised heel especially for this purpose) and they suffer from far fewer injuries than p'lifters and strongmen, so I'm wondering why you're advising against it.
Ok, this is a quote from the "insider's tell all handbook on weight training technique"
" Never squat with a board, plate or block under you heel. Raising your heels produces a more upright torso but at the price of increased leg flexion and greatly increased knee stress and wear and tear." (there is a picture in the book to which the next sentance refers) "Note how the knees have moved way in front of an imaginary vertical line drawn from the toes. For knee safety the knees should never move in front of this imaginary lineand preferably should be two or more inches behind it. Do not elevate your heels!
All a bit dramatic sounding i know but that is how he writes.
Also on a personal note i have always found it to be precarious with anything under my heels, awkward and painful on the knee, so in my experience i have found it to be negative. I would think it more beneficial to work on flexibility than to raise the heels.
As for the raise in a weightlifters' shoe, i think i read something in that weightlifting encyclodedia about that; something about the angle of the stage. I will look into it.
Aside from that most weightlifters' knees seem screwed when they retire anyway so i am not sure their way is foolproof.
I used to live next door to a weightlifter who actually competed in the Olympics for England, he told me this amongst other things. I was not so interested at the time, i wish he lived next door now he would be an invaluable source of information.
AL
woohoo the girlfriend is gonna get me them for xmas!!
Alex (Big-AL)
31-10-2004, 17:25
Squatting barefooted screwed my knee up!I now have orthotics to go in my trainers because of problems with arches in my feet. I have got a pair of army boots that I will get some orthotics for and these will be more squatting shoes for the future
Well there is an answer for you martin, for some people at least it is potentially harmful.
AL
Knighty: I don't mean any offence, but the human body is designed to carryout any function without any footwear at all, that includes squatting.
Knighty: I don't mean any offence, but the human body is designed to carryout any function without any footwear at all, that includes squatting.
Ummm... Shouldn't you account for the fact that pre-historic man didn't do a great deal of squatting.
I think the phrase 'any function' is misleading, because we are quite patently of performing any function without footwear. How about "any function human beings would have been required to perform in the state of nature"?
However, that rules out heavy squatting...
I think that running around barefoot on rock and sand for 60+ years is a bit more taxing on the old ankles and knees than a bit of squatting.
I think that running around barefoot on rock and sand for 60+ years is a bit more taxing on the old ankles and knees than a bit of squatting.
Nevermind the fact that life expectancy at the time would have been well below 60 years, but running and squatting are simply not the same thing - You can't compare the two.
BengDogg
31-10-2004, 21:43
Ummm... Shouldn't you account for the fact that pre-historic man didn't do a great deal of squatting.
Arnt you forgetting Dinosaur training :D :041:
The taller you are the wider you will need to space your feet and flare your toes.
Can anyone explain to me please why this is so?
Ensure your knees are not forward of your toes.
I cant seem to squat without putting my knees over unless:
a) I round my back, or
b) I squat with a wide stance, or
c) I fall flat on my arse
I think this is a flexibility issue. Suggestions on how to work around it please?
Knighty, Ive recently had problems running and squatting, and my physio has told me Ive got flat feet too. This also caused me a knee prob, basically my kneecap is being dragged up and to the right instead of straight up because my quads arent blanaced out. I need to get custom oesthetics made to help correct the problem. Is that a similar problem to what you had? And how did you find it affected your squatting?
Brett, if you are flexible enough, point your feet straight forwards. IIRC when you walk, watch for if your feet point out then, if they do, you have weak hamstrings. So that may be another issue that needs addressing.
SOG. You can compare just about anything. Back in the day, lol, I did an awful lot of running, both on and off road. I had the very latest in technology in terms of footwear and it still gave me shin splints, sore ankles and crunchy sore knees. These days I squat in the region of 7-10x what I could then, and only swimm 2xWeek (so do no running). I have no issus with my knees, shins, ankles or feet anymore. It not a coincidence.
Again, the body has evolved over millions of years to; run+jump (a lot worse than squatting in terms of how much force your feet/ankles get batterd with imo) hop, pick things up (deadlift) and all that in bare feet on some of the most harsh terrain our poncy feet have ever seen, let alone walked on.
It is my opinion, that deadlifting barefoot is postitively good for you, and squatting barefoot (whilst I don't do it) wont do you any harm either - assuming your form is spot on.
IIRC when you walk, watch for if your feet point out then, if they do, you have weak hamstrings. So that may be another issue that needs addressing.
I think I read a westside article which stated if you walk with toes flared out you have tight hip flexors.
GoldenArrow
01-11-2004, 12:35
Or piriformis..
BengDogg
02-11-2004, 15:51
Just ordered my shoes! :D Excited at the thought of not hurting my foot every time i nudge anything at last!
Those trainers look great.
I'll get a pair when I get to the UK. Cost a fortune here I bet.
OK guys I have a choice... I can either get:
a) a pair of chuck taylors that everyone raves on about for £30 or £35 (cant remember) from a shop near me
or b) i can get those adidas ones from that website
what do u think are better?
Man of Steel
05-11-2004, 17:36
If you want to be a real powerlifter then you need a pair of chuck's, but make sure they're a tight fit. £35 is cheap for a pair of trainers, so if you really don't like them then you won't have wasted alot of money but they'll probably help with your squat and deadlift. I hope you don't squat and deadlift on carpet.
If you want to be a real powerlifter then you need a pair of chuck's, but make sure they're a tight fit. £35 is cheap for a pair of trainers, so if you really don't like them then you won't have wasted alot of money but they'll probably help with your squat and deadlift. I hope you don't squat and deadlift on carpet.
its thinish carpet... i have no option really... thats why all my gym lifts are better than my home ones
rip up the carpet or buy a piece of block board and do everything on that
BengDogg
05-11-2004, 20:12
Hang fire on those trainers cos mine havnt turned up yet and i have had to ring them today, I am hoping they arnt gonna mess me around, will keep you updated but basically if they aint turned up monday they are lost inn transit
BengDogg
05-11-2004, 20:13
Like Help said btw get some ply wood cut to size, quite cheap
GoldenArrow
05-11-2004, 20:33
Hmm... that'd be the first problem I've ever heard from them, I've had three things off 'em and most of my club has ordered from them at one point..
rip up the carpet or buy a piece of block board and do everything on that
good idea, i'll probs go to b&q soon!
BengDogg
05-11-2004, 21:56
Hmm... that'd be the first problem I've ever heard from them, I've had three things off 'em and most of my club has ordered from them at one point..
Thsat can only be a good thing then, Hope fully it is just royal mail being slow.
BengDogg
06-11-2004, 19:00
Good news the shoes turned up after all, Just my useless office never told me! I got em and tried em They are the 5hit!
So do you think I should get these chuck taylors? tbh I don't think they are that great, the sole seems almost springy
BengDogg
06-11-2004, 21:03
I dunno i bought the addidas
Man of Steel
06-11-2004, 22:43
My chuck's aren't springy. You should buy them for the sole reason that real powerlifters wear Chuck Taylor's :045:
http://www.converse.com/LiveFiles/1/142/M9621_220.jpg
these are the ones they sell near me, are they the right ones?
Man of Steel
08-11-2004, 00:28
They're the ones! The reds are quite smart and they'll add at least 10kg to your squat (after a couple of months training ;) ).
cool, i'm gonna go down and try some on for size soon... ive told the woman to get me any colour for xmas except pink!!
vBulletin® v3.8.4, Copyright ©2000-2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.